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Magic numbers: retirement/investment coffers

ARL (Moderator) – December 18, 2007 07:51PM Reply Quote
Non APPL.O financial/economic mumbo jumbo...

ARL (Moderator) – December 18, 2007 07:53PM Reply Quote
Well crap...

Guess I can kiss goodbye to $200K worth of so-called blue-chip investments...

rino – December 18, 2007 09:51PM Reply Quote
In America, the only respectable form of socialism is socialism for the rich.

Market has been swinging like a bat past 6 months. Gone +-20k for me.

ghidorah – December 19, 2007 12:42AM Reply Quote
Raise taxes on cavemen. --jw
I guess I don't feel so bad about not having any money in my IRA now.


Nobody Special – December 19, 2007 02:25AM Reply Quote
Ah laddie, ye shudda sunk yer money in tings wort 'avin'


comic books, now there's an investment with potential.

dharlow – December 19, 2007 04:02AM Reply Quote
Gone about 50K here over just the last few months, getting painful to look at.


Robert Taylor – December 19, 2007 03:45PM Reply Quote
200K, Tone? What possessed you to put that many eggs in the basket?

YTD I'm at about 6% up on my retirement assets, which, while not great, beats being kicked in the head.

rino – December 19, 2007 07:33PM Reply Quote
In America, the only respectable form of socialism is socialism for the rich.
What is this, the no avatar zone? Where are ye pictures?!

ARL (Moderator) – December 20, 2007 01:45AM Reply Quote
>>200K, Tone? What possessed you to put that many eggs in the basket?

Two property funds, one Centro domestic and one Centro international (and it is only $200K out of $6M so it wasn't too consolidated).

It also turns out things aren't quite as bad as first thought.

Turns out my debt exposure is only roughly 5% of the $200K. Whew.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/20/2007 01:46AM by Tony Leggett.

Robert Taylor – December 20, 2007 01:44PM Reply Quote
OK, Tony, that's MUCH better news.

Robert... no. I didn't have an avatar before, I'm not adding one now. :)

(mental note: need to find the turn avatars off setting I had like Ye Olde Spork.)

stan adams – December 20, 2007 02:43PM Reply Quote
I dunno Tony. My sister and I talk about investment related stuff a lot. Mostly in regard to how things are going for our mom. Dad left her kind of locked into some too safe things, but the "trustee" is moving more and more to real crazy "high net worth" clients and it while it would cost less to do things in a less institutionally structured way, it would eat her capital to undo things and the total return probably won't be any better. When you really have to depend on a fixed sum (like mom and you{sorta}) you really can't listen to "investor news" as much of it is part of the world wide hype machine and is so sales driven as to be irrelavent to those that live off their investments.

I'm glad your loss / downside is much smaller than you feared. It is generally easier to adjust your lifestyle if your investments are too conservative than if your investments are too risky and things swing wildly away from expectations.

While there are an awful lot of ugly messes right now due to the "global credit crunch" there are still many parts of the global economy that are going to have great returns and many encouraging signs for at least the next 3-5 years. Depending on political shifts it is very hard to say much about the prognosis beyond that. Another cycle to think about is the huge slowdown in global merger activity -- this will fire back up as investors get a better handle on credit markets, and this will offer some great opportunities for folks that like to participate either directly or through bond purchases. Another plus is the trading in bonds is much less widely done than in stocks or their derivatives and has a bit more "dampening" built it.

morganti – December 26, 2007 10:00AM Reply Quote
The Big shitpile(tm) hit me pretty rough. Im down about 7% over the last 9 months. I'm still in quite good shape and have certainly migrated away from some of the players that seem to be in greater exposure than most.

I think 2008 is going to be rougher than 2007.

Today is different than the Asian Meltdown in the late 90's. It's different than the S&L crisis. In those cases, we had a good idea of how bad the situation was. It could be "priced into the market" so to speak. The market "dropped" i.e. corrected people lost money, but things carried on. Now we have people that packaged mortgages (good and bad and worse) into larger investment vehicles, and those vehicles were then repackaged again and again. Sort of like a pyramid scheme, by the time it gets around to the "last guys in", the investors really don't know what they're getting, they're trusting that everyone up the chain did their due dilligence.

This is the kind of stuff that's just crazy. A 7.6billion dollar loan, for a 6.8billion dollar property while putting down only 50million in equity???

Morg "Maybe we should invest in gold... or Pet Rocks!" anti

El Jeffe – December 26, 2007 10:27AM Reply Quote
What a journey.

do you play the market or have you hired an investment planner?
Actually, that Q is good for everyone participating in this thread, imo.

I have a guy with Ameriprise. Been with them for probably a dozen years or more. The actual rep changed once, due to a retirement-in-progress. I like the new guy, too. The previous guy lives a stone's throw, and would jog thru my neighborhood from time to time, as well.

Not sure how well I would have done by myself, but I can't complain. I don't have annual returns info at my fingertips.

What a journey.

rino – December 26, 2007 11:54AM Reply Quote
In America, the only respectable form of socialism is socialism for the rich.
My investments:

I play a portfolio of equities on my own with my own research.
That amount doubled by 2006, and, it is up ~21% since last year. It started with a small amount in some blue chips (dogs of the dow in 1997) and AAPL. Now it's those same dogs (hey they've been good and stable) with a bit more tech, some more dogs, and some stuff in new sectors I don't know about.

I have a Fidelity account which get's infused monthly with my pre-tax contribution as well as my employer's 11% of my salary infusion.
I choose which funds these contributions go into, and can balance it or change where the contributions go anytime.
This has not been so great. For a long time I just didn't pay enough attention and just barely is profitable.
Late in '06 I started putting new contributions into Latin America and China, plus buying into more small caps and it's been doing better.

I'm influenced by this but it's not in my name: money my wife has in an account managed by investment bankers at Huntington in Ohio. It's done well. Sort of serves as a barometer for me...


It takes work but is not a bad way to spend time. I was thinking of taking a portion of it to start buying investment property in '07 but I've done so well that I figure why bother ... real estate probably has a little room on the down side yet to come even up here where we haven't seen the same bottom as other regions.

The dumbest thing is we don't have living wills.

El Jeffe – December 26, 2007 12:32PM Reply Quote
What a journey.
I think I'd spend more time with little to no better returns. Not sure how many $$ I put in, but 6 figures current balance. A mixture of pre-tax (whammy at the end), and post-tax/no-tax items. My guy is big on balancing the retirement tax whammy. Keep it balanced so there 1/3 you pay taxes on now, 1/3 you pay taxes on then, and 1/3 that are tax-free. Makes as much sense as anything out there.

And considering I am one sole measly income responsible first and foremost to just keeping a family of five sustained, with very little to no real budget for fun/frivolous stuff, I feel pretty good for being well on my way to millionaire status should my current luck hold out. Which I firmly believe can't, since my luck always sucks. Or, I'll die first. :)


What a journey.

stan adams – December 26, 2007 12:36PM Reply Quote

Get that legal stuff done :http://www.nolo.com/Products.cfm/catID/FD1795A9-8049-422C-9087838F86A2BC2B/309/

Real estate, as a passive 'sector' type investment is more volatile than just about any other, and actively owning property is a helluva lot work. I 100% agree it ain't worth the bother.

21% one year gains are impressive as hell, you really ought to do some profit taking, even the professional fund mangers that have had 5-10 runs look foolish when they hope to beat the historic averages for too long.

How "well" is the professionally managed account at Huntington doing? The key is "total return after fees" and that can be a depressing number,

I sorta hate my 401k(s) too -- I have a bunch of money in them and it never seems to do more than about 5% no matter which large funds I move into/out of. I'm giving some serious thought to consolidating them at Schwab (or Vanguard or Fidelity) as at least those places seem committed to the "little guy" while everyone else is chasing "high net worth clients". Ugh.

Robert Taylor – December 26, 2007 02:09PM Reply Quote
My 401ks are through Fidelity and include index funds. Short of having the cash to by SPYders in large quantities, this is probably the best way to roll. I've also been fairly aggressive in investing international index funds (since I don't think the dollar will recover anytime soon).

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/26/2007 02:10PM by Robert Taylor.

El Jeffe – January 16, 2008 08:52AM Reply Quote
What a journey.

rino – January 16, 2008 09:41AM Reply Quote
In America, the only respectable form of socialism is socialism for the rich.
I've been funneling all my monthly contributions into Latin Am. and China funds at Fidelity ... just to balance out domestically weighted funds vs. international. I agree with you -- we are probably heading into some murky territory w/re to domestic performance.

morganti – January 17, 2008 07:25AM Reply Quote
That'll be the great thing if the "fair tax" gets any traction. Tax retirement funds that were "tax free".

Morg "AARP might be a little miffed about that" anti

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