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Apple's relationship with the press, customers, and dealers

tliet's Avatar Picture tliet – March 20, 2008 09:34AM Reply Quote
Although we don't live in the Apple is beleaguered times anymore, there's still enough to be said about them...
Transplanted once again...

The Gay Blade - 05:54pm Mar 31, 2000 EST
The Blade will attempt to transplant yet another rhetorical sapling here
on the Spork boards by copping a page from the delightful Brian Miller,
writing eloquently on the superannuated boards of yesteryear:

Brian Miller - 03:07pm Sep 30, 1999 PT
The man with a plan

My recent PowerBook G3 fiasco notwithstanding, I am beginning to wonder if
Apple is planning on abandoning "small fry customers." Consider the

1) Apple's war with the Macintosh press;
2) Apple's slashing and burning of small local dealers, who often provided
the best service "in a pinch";
3) Apple's continued horrendous customer service breaches (individual Apple
Store orders cancelled in favour of large educaction/business orders).

Pulling all this evidence together and analysing it makes me feel far more
"worried" about Apple's future than any time under Amelio. Consider, for
instance, what all of those resources spent on lawyers threatening tiny Mac
sites could do in customer service and relations.

Before we consider Apple's "invasion" into the Fortune 1000 enterprise to
be ready, we have to focus on Apple's status in its own current markets. In
my view, there's a lot of "retrenching" to do before they're ready. They
can start by ceasing their intimidation of Mac publishers, letting the damn
Mac rags publish OS 8.6 on their cover disks, and spending a bit more time,
effort, and energy on a "satisfy the customer at all costs throughout the
organisation" policy. These are all core competencies they'll need before
they can even THINK of invading the big-enterprise space.

El Jeffe – February 19, 2016 05:53AM Reply Quote
What a journey.
So, No Agenda broke down the court order more than I had bothered to find out on this.
Someone in the FBI (et al) knows their shit.
The court order goes into explicit detail, and for the most part is NOT requesting a backdoor (in form of key) or for Apple themselves to break the encryption, at least for this ONE device..


Sounds like Apple most likely CAN comply to this request. And I'm thinking a very long numeric passcode is better (less likely to be compelled by police/courts) to give up than a fingerprint. What is max numeric keypad code? I use 8 digit.

El Jeffe – February 19, 2016 06:22AM Reply Quote
What a journey.

johnny k – February 19, 2016 05:13PM Reply Quote
The question is not whether they technically can - Apple hasn't denied this. The issue is whether the FBI is using a 200-year-old law legitimately to compel Apple to make their own devices less secure. No matter how the language is phrased to suggest that it will only work for one device, the fact is that Apple would be doing 95% of the hacker's work to make all devices insecure.

Even if you believe that our government would never abuse this power, as troubling is that this precedent opens the door for China to demand the same. I'm surprised few in our government seem to care about that. The FBI needs to be reined in.

El Jeffe – February 19, 2016 05:43PM Reply Quote
What a journey.
they will eventually write whichever law they need; and/or serve a national security letter.
They will not be denied. Whether or not PUBLICLY it is ever KNOWN or covered up and cooperated with one way or another, is another story.

Cloudscout – February 19, 2016 05:54PM Reply Quote
Det finnes ikke dårlig vær, bare dårlige klær!
That was my first impression as well but how would this make the devices any less secure?

I haven't read the links that Bill shared but I have seen others that put it this way:

The only thing that prevents the FBI from doing this themselves is the fact that the hardware requires that the OS image be signed with Apple's private key. Rather than ask Apple for their private key which would be blatant overreach, they're asking Apple to make a firmware image that contains limitations which would prohibit the firmware from running on any other devices. That means they're free to use any/all of the unique identifiers on the device to ensure that it will only run on this handset. The FBI wouldn't be able to modify that firmware to run on any other devices because they would be unable to sign their modified code.

This isn't about opening a backdoor that can be used repeatedly. This method would require Apple's cooperation for every new device they would want to unlock. If they were looking for a way to do this without an explicit court order, I could see a problem but that doesn't appear to be the case here.

And China? Not relevant. Complying with this order doesn't make them any more susceptible to similar orders in China. In fact, the only way for Apple to prevent such a thing would be to implement TPM which is illegal in China anyway.

John Willoughby – February 19, 2016 06:13PM Reply Quote
Cyberdyne Systems Customer Support

El Jeffe – February 19, 2016 06:36PM Reply Quote
What a journey.
he's not the only one. I've heard sound bites from many folks that are not technically savvy.

ARL (Moderator) – February 19, 2016 07:43PM Reply Quote

And doing so via an iPhone.

This development, however, could be interesting.

John Willoughby – February 19, 2016 08:37PM Reply Quote
Cyberdyne Systems Customer Support
Just saw that. I wonder if they'd backed a car over the phone if they'd require Apple to re-assemble it.

John Willoughby – February 19, 2016 08:51PM Reply Quote
Cyberdyne Systems Customer Support
(Unrelated.) This seems like a bad idea. One of the great things about the Apple Store is the lack of sales pressure.

ARL (Moderator) – February 19, 2016 11:46PM Reply Quote

I'm surprised Apple isn't shouting this point out from the rooftops...

dharlow – February 20, 2016 05:03PM Reply Quote
Apple Stores are turning into the typical retail store.

El Jeffe – February 22, 2016 12:49PM Reply Quote
What a journey.
thoughts on Apple, Cook, gubmint compelling...

- Apple leave USA in a little or a big way
- Tim cook resign
- Tim cook run for public office.

- so many things we don't know. Feels like being played. False premises all over the place
- so many other ways to get at information etc.

James DeBenedetti – February 22, 2016 01:01PM Reply Quote
All of those sound ridiculous.

El Jeffe – February 22, 2016 01:38PM Reply Quote
What a journey.
does anyone have a problem with Apple purposefully using what they know about HOW a government try to get into phones, and using that to continue to close those gaps?
That is, perhaps put the passcode delay into a more hardware/firmware?
What will work for one government Apple might be compelled to work for other governments.

And Tim Cook REPEATED that essentially doing this might put certain human relationships at grave risk of even death.

"History has shown us that sacrificing our right to privacy can have dire consequences -- we still live in a world where all people are not treated equally. Too many people do not feel free to practice their religion or express their opinion, or love who they choose... ,"
said Cook, who is among the highest-profile business leaders to publicly identify as gay.

I take that to believe that Cook equates this to potentially putting people at risk of death. I believe him when he tells us this, and his convictions. He might rather resign than give into getting people killed. He might choose to run for office to protect people from getting killed. Maybe not in this country, but to work towards any ways in which he can help.



James DeBenedetti – February 22, 2016 06:02PM Reply Quote
I'm not sure why you think someone who loads tens of billions of dollars of debt onto an otherwise debt-free company solely to avoid paying taxes actually cares enough about our country to run for office (our should expect to win an election if he did).

ARL (Moderator) – February 22, 2016 06:16PM Reply Quote

Say Apple cooperates.

Are you comfortable with Russia China and probably Isis also having this backdoor? That is what will happen.

Cloudscout – February 22, 2016 07:27PM Reply Quote
Det finnes ikke dårlig vær, bare dårlige klær!
I don't see how that is true. If it's possible to execute a hack like this, what would prevent Russia and China from forcing Apple to do it regardless of whether the US does so?

As for ISIS, that makes no sense. How would ISIS force Apple to open devices for them?

El Jeffe – February 22, 2016 07:37PM Reply Quote
What a journey.

Say Apple cooperates.

Are you comfortable with Russia China and probably Isis also having this backdoor? That is what will happen.

I want NOTHING of the sort. What gave you that idea?
I am cheering Tim Cook on.
I fear/know he will lose.
I think that is pretty clear position. Not sure why you ask me about that?

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