Reciprocating Mass

what kind of vehicle are you wanting? Did you like your XJ?

What a journey.

We want a people mover that isn't a minivan and isn't a giant house on wheels with a name evoking reminiscence of old growth forests.

I'm thinking along the lines of:
* Subaru Forester
* Jeep something (that alone tells me to stay away, they've diluted the product line with too many names) -- OK so no Jeep
* I like the idea of the Ford Edge or other cross-over (gosh Ford Edge is expensive, for a ford! can't even get leather(ette) seating except on the 30k model, suxor) -- OK so no Ford
* like the idea of Honda Element -- but no bench seat means only 4 ppl not 5 -- probably not an Element
* Toyata RAV -- not exciting but good car
* Mini Clubman, the shoe-in candidate is out due to its low tow rating.

So that's the range. Will not spend past 30K on such a non-investment. More comfortable at 25k-ish max. Ideally, 18k!

We like using less gas rather than more gas.

Don't count out the Jeep Patriot. Its a heck of a deal, especially when you factor in the lifetime power-train warranty.

What about the Ford Taurus X (formerly known as the Ford Freestyle)?

Ahhh, the Patriot uses 4cyl vs. the Liberty's 6? Is that why the Liberty gets such horrid mileage?
But the Liberty has a great roof(less) option... mmmm. But I don't want to see an average 18mpg!

Great suggestion, thanks.


Oh and I really hate these american vendors who don't let you upgrade to a better material on the seats! I don't want cloth, I have a dog and children. I require leather(ette).

Ford Taurus X

isn't that pronounced "Ford Taurus Ten"? And then there'll be Ten.1, Ten.2... .

ddt

Quote
rino
We want a people mover that isn't a minivan and isn't a giant house on wheels with a name evoking reminiscence of old growth forests.

I'm thinking along the lines of:
* Subaru Forester
* Jeep something (that alone tells me to stay away, they've diluted the product line with too many names) -- OK so no Jeep
* I like the idea of the Ford Edge or other cross-over (gosh Ford Edge is expensive, for a ford! can't even get leather(ette) seating except on the 30k model, suxor) -- OK so no Ford
* like the idea of Honda Element -- but no bench seat means only 4 ppl not 5 -- probably not an Element
* Toyata RAV -- not exciting but good car
* Mini Clubman, the shoe-in candidate is out due to its low tow rating.

So that's the range. Will not spend past 30K on such a non-investment. More comfortable at 25k-ish max. Ideally, 18k!

We like using less gas rather than more gas.

I think the Patriot is very good. Took one out in 8" of snow. Very competent.

But, look at Dodge Journey - just listened to a very positive review on Car & Driver Radio podcast. Can get AWD, too. 7 pass seating available.

Or, Toyota RAV4. I did NOT like it in the exact SAME 8" snow, though. The CR-V, RDX and Patriot were the best in the snow, imo. I did not like Acura's traction control, though. At least with Patriot it lets you move/and lose some traction. The Acura you would sit, with your foot all the way to the floor, and NO ENGINE RPMs. It was scary, especially if you could see someone coming at you and NUTHING HAPPENIN.

And then there is a whole host of other ones. The Mazda5 is neat, tidy, small people mover. Try it out. It's the TRUE MINI van.
And the CX-7 is step up, bigger, truckier.

And I like the outgoing Pacifica, too.

What a journey.

Great thoughts ...

I have traction control on my Mini that does something similar. The upshot is you can turn it off quickly with a switch, because sometimes you need to spin through something fast.

(Pacifica is too large a beast for me.)

You can completely rake on a Ford Freestyle/Taurus-X. Depending on how big the dealer is, they may still have 2007 models that they couldn't. Some call the old models with the CVT underpowered, but others say they are adequate. They are nice because they are working on the Volvo S80 platform and they deliver solid mileage in this class.

The Pacifica is another item that you can get great deals on, although the fuel economy is not that great. Very nice interior, however. You'll also get good deals on any Jeep that is not a Wrangler. If you are concerned about towing, the Liberty is your better bet. It's also closer in size to your Cherokee.

I think Pacifica has been the nicest interior for what it is for a long time. The Journey is a baby-Pac.

What a journey.

Interesting story about weight loss... a guy who was over 500 pounds was given 6 months to live unless he got his stomach stapled and was only given a 50/50 chance of surviving the surgery. Instead, he bought a special bike and did it on his own.

Something I didn't realize until I read this article is that Minneapolis is the #2 cycling city in the US. I would have thought milder climate cities would fill the top spots. I looked it up and found out that the ranking refers to the percentage of people who commute to work by bicycle. Here's the breakdown of the top bike-commuter cities:

1) Portland - 3.5%
2) Minneapolis - 2.4%
3) Seattle - 2.3%
4) Tucson - 2.2%
5) San Francisco - 1.8%
6) Sacramento - 1.8%
7) Washington DC - 1.7%
8) Oakland - 1.5%
9) Honolulu - 1.4%
10) Denver - 1.4%

Bikes are outlawed here. (just from observation)

What a journey.

Once while in graduate school in Chicago a cop pulled me over while riding my bike, chiding me for making an illegal left turn and further braying about how "this isn't China".

"Oh yeah? Then explain that delicious Chinese food I just ate!"

There are A LOT of hard core bicycle cops in Chicago now -- some these guys were on their Treks & Cannondales with the flashing lights when it was like 15 degrees... That said the pot holes and general amount of road destruction that the winter has done makes it especially hard to ride on the weekends, let alone commute. A handful of suburbs have bike paths and trails, but those don't get plowed and often have a lot of tree cover so that they are icy messes in the winter.

That chart has got to be only cities above 1 million or something -- every college town in California has like a 75%+ ride to work rate...

alan, want to comment on davis?

ddt

My professor in Chicago found Metra somewhat bike-unfriendly.

Johnny:

That's nothing. My mom uses a cleaning service that this woman worked for: http://chicagoist.com/2008/02/11/busted.php
...and they thought having the bike rack on front was the safest spot for the driver to watch out for bicyclists...

Was in a little fender bender tonight. Nobody hurt, no damage to my vehicle, but thank you Japanese engineering. Other guy had small damage to the bumper. Just one of those fucking days.

ugh, sorry to hear. glad everyone's okay. still a pain.

ddt