Granberry's Parlor Politics. Don Granberry on the old Spork Boards was quite fond of talking about them, and here we continue on in that fine tradition. http://www.macedition.com/forums/read.php?4,20,20#msg-20 Mon, 20 May 2013 00:28:29 -0400 Phorum 5.2.16 http://www.macedition.com/forums/read.php?4,20,42271#msg-42271 Re: Granberry's Parlor http://www.macedition.com/forums/read.php?4,20,42271#msg-42271 Tony Leggett Spork Central Wed, 15 May 2013 21:17:11 -0400 http://www.macedition.com/forums/read.php?4,20,42259#msg-42259 Re: Granberry's Parlor http://www.macedition.com/forums/read.php?4,20,42259#msg-42259 this could cut the Gordian knot of the gun issue.

ddt]]> ddt Spork Central Wed, 15 May 2013 00:09:08 -0400 http://www.macedition.com/forums/read.php?4,20,42234#msg-42234 Re: Granberry's Parlor http://www.macedition.com/forums/read.php?4,20,42234#msg-42234 Tony Leggett Spork Central Sun, 12 May 2013 19:54:13 -0400 http://www.macedition.com/forums/read.php?4,20,42224#msg-42224 Re: Granberry's Parlor http://www.macedition.com/forums/read.php?4,20,42224#msg-42224
Granted, they were pretty blatant about how self-centered their "forward" causes were. They need to learn not everyone thinks that their success is everyone's benefit, and need to learn how to play the "pitch for political position" game.

It's not surprising that they're self-centered fucks. What's surprising is how poor they are at it.

ddt]]> ddt Spork Central Sat, 11 May 2013 21:15:16 -0400 http://www.macedition.com/forums/read.php?4,20,42219#msg-42219 Re: Granberry's Parlor http://www.macedition.com/forums/read.php?4,20,42219#msg-42219
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El Jeffe
But there is no Jobs to Zuck's 'gates' for kiddies/folks to glom onto, is there?

I find it interesting that FWD.us is fragmenting, first campaign out of the gate.

AFA a foil to Zuckerberg, I don't see one yet. Bezos isn't it, as much as Bezos might think he would be, if asked. MAYBE Hastings.]]> porruka Spork Central Sat, 11 May 2013 19:18:12 -0400 http://www.macedition.com/forums/read.php?4,20,42218#msg-42218 Re: Granberry's Parlor http://www.macedition.com/forums/read.php?4,20,42218#msg-42218 Seems more like Gates (early) than Jobs (forever) in some ways.
But there is no Jobs to Zuck's 'gates' for kiddies/folks to glom onto, is there?]]> El Jeffe Spork Central Sat, 11 May 2013 19:01:44 -0400 http://www.macedition.com/forums/read.php?4,20,42204#msg-42204 Re: Granberry's Parlor http://www.macedition.com/forums/read.php?4,20,42204#msg-42204 Cloudscout Spork Central Sat, 11 May 2013 01:26:48 -0400 http://www.macedition.com/forums/read.php?4,20,42203#msg-42203 Re: Granberry's Parlor http://www.macedition.com/forums/read.php?4,20,42203#msg-42203 Dave Loudin Spork Central Sat, 11 May 2013 01:25:14 -0400 http://www.macedition.com/forums/read.php?4,20,42176#msg-42176 Re: Granberry's Parlor http://www.macedition.com/forums/read.php?4,20,42176#msg-42176
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ddt
Good point. Sometimes that is the proper response in factual disagreements, though!

ddt

No it's not!]]> Cloudscout Spork Central Thu, 09 May 2013 13:30:47 -0400 http://www.macedition.com/forums/read.php?4,20,42175#msg-42175 Re: Granberry's Parlor http://www.macedition.com/forums/read.php?4,20,42175#msg-42175
ddt]]> ddt Spork Central Thu, 09 May 2013 13:04:45 -0400 http://www.macedition.com/forums/read.php?4,20,42174#msg-42174 Re: Granberry's Parlor http://www.macedition.com/forums/read.php?4,20,42174#msg-42174
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ddt
Snappy, science-based rejoinders to climate change deniers.

ddt

Taking the statements and the rebuttals at face value (dangerous, I know, but no time to independently confirm each one), it's amazing how many rebuttals boil down to "That's a lie. The opposite is true."]]> porruka Spork Central Thu, 09 May 2013 12:20:35 -0400 http://www.macedition.com/forums/read.php?4,20,42173#msg-42173 Re: Granberry's Parlor http://www.macedition.com/forums/read.php?4,20,42173#msg-42173
ddt]]> ddt Spork Central Thu, 09 May 2013 11:50:11 -0400 http://www.macedition.com/forums/read.php?4,20,42172#msg-42172 Re: Granberry's Parlor http://www.macedition.com/forums/read.php?4,20,42172#msg-42172 tomierna Spork Central Thu, 09 May 2013 11:38:08 -0400 http://www.macedition.com/forums/read.php?4,20,42167#msg-42167 Re: Granberry's Parlor http://www.macedition.com/forums/read.php?4,20,42167#msg-42167 Snappy, science-based rejoinders to climate change deniers.

ddt]]> ddt Spork Central Wed, 08 May 2013 18:42:28 -0400 http://www.macedition.com/forums/read.php?4,20,42153#msg-42153 Re: Granberry's Parlor http://www.macedition.com/forums/read.php?4,20,42153#msg-42153 http://www.popehat.com/2013/05/07/blog-post-youtube-comment-mississippi-supreme-court-order-whatever/

A Mississippi Supreme Court Judge chooses to use his dissent opinion in a stay of execution order to demonstrate his ignorance of federal law.]]> Cloudscout Spork Central Tue, 07 May 2013 20:33:17 -0400 http://www.macedition.com/forums/read.php?4,20,42152#msg-42152 Re: Granberry's Parlor http://www.macedition.com/forums/read.php?4,20,42152#msg-42152 http://www.cnsnews.com/news/article/state-dept-won-t-say-its-own-officials-set-testify-benghazi-are-credible-people
It's nice he did not say BAD things about them. But the neutrality of his off-putting makes one think it's not GOOD things.
That clip is about all I have time for today in the world of politics. Been a crappy work day... not done yet....]]> El Jeffe Spork Central Tue, 07 May 2013 19:50:38 -0400 http://www.macedition.com/forums/read.php?4,20,42151#msg-42151 Re: Granberry's Parlor http://www.macedition.com/forums/read.php?4,20,42151#msg-42151 http://sammyterrynightmares.com]]> El Jeffe Spork Central Tue, 07 May 2013 05:37:51 -0400 http://www.macedition.com/forums/read.php?4,20,42149#msg-42149 Re: Granberry's Parlor http://www.macedition.com/forums/read.php?4,20,42149#msg-42149
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ddt
I can't disagree with Pierce on this. I understand sharing things with your family, and teaching proper safety from a young age, but we don't let five-year-olds drive, either.

http://www.esquire.com/blogs/politics/kentucky-rifles-for-children-050213

ddt

Things we don't trust five-year-olds with:

1. Matches

2. Cars and other heavy machinery

3. Chainsaws

4. Industrial cleaning products, insecticides and poisons

5. Guns (even the ones with Buzz Lightyear or Dora the Explorer stickers on them)

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* A 5-year old *may* be old enough to "own" his or her own gun, but that doesn't mean it needs to be within reach at all times. Chemistry sets, knives, transformers from old televisions, and the neighbor's cat also fall into this category. There are a world of things that could be considered dangerous, even deadly, that *could* be within the sphere of a young child and could be misused to terrible effect.

Nope. No 5-year-old anywhere, ever is "old enough" to own their own gun. In my opinion they should not even be touching other peoples guns. Ditto for chemistry sets, sharp knives and other objects unless under stringent supervision...

God, I have a four-year-old and the thought of her even with safety scissors makes me cringe...

Ten year olds, if they're responsible, can maybe have their own guns. Slug guns or BB guns, that is.

Maaayybe by age 12-13 kids can start shooting regular guns under supervision.

The whole "I'm concerned they may mishandle an adult sized gun" thing is there for a reason -- it's telling you "DONT GIVE SMALL CHILDREN GUNS!"]]> Tony Leggett Spork Central Tue, 07 May 2013 01:21:59 -0400 http://www.macedition.com/forums/read.php?4,20,42148#msg-42148 Re: Granberry's Parlor http://www.macedition.com/forums/read.php?4,20,42148#msg-42148 johnny k Spork Central Tue, 07 May 2013 00:04:13 -0400 http://www.macedition.com/forums/read.php?4,20,42141#msg-42141 Re: Granberry's Parlor http://www.macedition.com/forums/read.php?4,20,42141#msg-42141
http://hoodedutilitarian.com/2011/09/explaining-the-joke/]]> Tony Leggett Spork Central Mon, 06 May 2013 21:03:01 -0400 http://www.macedition.com/forums/read.php?4,20,42139#msg-42139 Re: Granberry's Parlor http://www.macedition.com/forums/read.php?4,20,42139#msg-42139
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Tony Leggett
That is awesome (is that really Krugman in the foreground or someone else?)

The answer.]]> James DeBenedetti Spork Central Mon, 06 May 2013 20:37:56 -0400 http://www.macedition.com/forums/read.php?4,20,42128#msg-42128 Re: Granberry's Parlor http://www.macedition.com/forums/read.php?4,20,42128#msg-42128
No, it's not The Onion but with a quote like:

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In Holmes County, a posse allegedly broke into a home, lopping off the hair and whiskers of everyone inside, including a 13-year-old-girl and 74-year-old man.

you'd be forgiven for thinking so.]]> porruka Spork Central Mon, 06 May 2013 11:15:56 -0400 http://www.macedition.com/forums/read.php?4,20,42127#msg-42127 Re: Granberry's Parlor http://www.macedition.com/forums/read.php?4,20,42127#msg-42127 http://www.ewtn.com/tv/kids/index.asp

The campus, area is beautiful. Looks like something from Spain. http://catholicexchange.com/alabama-pilgrimage/
http://olamshrine.com

Again, I always admire the Amish life/style. Self supportive; very communal and helpful. Green. Back to basics. Funny language. ;)]]> El Jeffe Spork Central Mon, 06 May 2013 11:10:48 -0400 http://www.macedition.com/forums/read.php?4,20,42126#msg-42126 Re: Granberry's Parlor http://www.macedition.com/forums/read.php?4,20,42126#msg-42126
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ddt
[snip snip] my example was more of "can we at least agree on this?".

The thing is, no, not really. I might be willing to support some pretty radical ideas if there were high likelihood of success, but this (admittedly, with a few exceptions) smacks of security theater and to me, that's worse than doing nothing at all.

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ddt
Another anecdotal data point: http://talkingpointsmemo.com/archives/2013/05/when_stories_collide_1.php?ref=fpblg

This seems -- SEEMS -- to be a textbook case of how nutcase political paranoia is fed by, and in turn feeds, gun violence. I can expand that thought later if needed.

You're always going to have an echo chamber amplification. As long as the nutcase running the classes hasn't done anything wrong (and I don't know one way or the other), this amplification is something we (the opposite nutcases) have to endure. Freedom to do X,Y,Z doesn't mean everyone will like X,Y,Z, simply that those who oppose it have limited means to prevent it.]]> porruka Spork Central Mon, 06 May 2013 11:03:13 -0400 http://www.macedition.com/forums/read.php?4,20,42123#msg-42123 Re: Granberry's Parlor http://www.macedition.com/forums/read.php?4,20,42123#msg-42123 Keeping the guns locked and ammo separate *will* prevent certain incidents from happening, but that's only addressing a symptom, not a cause.

Totally agree.

we're not teaching people NOT to have that intent, NOT to reach for the gun

Also totally agree.

Yes, since I was writing a quick post in between things, I cut a few corners, and was "negotiating with myself". I was taking the lockbox idea not as a solution but a minor, least-objectionable step that could at least reduce certain kinds of accidental shootings or shootings that came from sudden rises of passion. It's something that has not proved unworkable in, say, Scotland. I agree that there are much larger and deeper problems and more and more serious work needs to be done; my example was more of "can we at least agree on this?".

Another anecdotal data point: http://talkingpointsmemo.com/archives/2013/05/when_stories_collide_1.php?ref=fpblg

This seems -- SEEMS -- to be a textbook case of how nutcase political paranoia is fed by, and in turn feeds, gun violence. I can expand that thought later if needed.

ddt]]> ddt Spork Central Mon, 06 May 2013 10:37:12 -0400 http://www.macedition.com/forums/read.php?4,20,42099#msg-42099 Re: Granberry's Parlor http://www.macedition.com/forums/read.php?4,20,42099#msg-42099
I just caught a RW commentator making almost the same argument I made here. I suppose I should be appalled at the alignment, but there it is.]]> porruka Spork Central Thu, 02 May 2013 19:48:36 -0400 http://www.macedition.com/forums/read.php?4,20,42098#msg-42098 Re: Granberry's Parlor http://www.macedition.com/forums/read.php?4,20,42098#msg-42098
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ddt
I agree on all those points. Though I think "must be kept in a locked box/cabinet/credenza/whatever and not loaded, with bullets elsewhere" is a common-sense regulation, on the par with regulations on fire safety, electrical wiring, keeping unsafe cars off the road until repaired, etc.

ddt

I'm actually going to disagree with you somewhat there, ddt.

Keeping the guns locked and ammo separate *will* prevent certain incidents from happening, but that's only addressing a symptom, not a cause. If the mere presence of deadly objects is enough to invoke their use, then even the most ardent hater of the object has to admit there's something deeper at work.

Now, perhaps you equate the "locked and separated" with what I would call "out of reach", but there's an important difference. As anyone could see, driving in the south even as late as the 80s with shotgun racks in the back windows of pickup trucks, "out of reach" doesn't mean physically barring access. It means that there has to be intent to get them.

And this, even if all other arguments against guns were held as true, lies at the heart of at least one issue: we're not teaching people NOT to have that intent, NOT to reach for the gun. Or the ineffectual ricin. Or the knives. Or the pressure cookers.

As others besides me have pointed out far more eloquently, the NRA *used* to be a gun owner advocacy and training organization. Now it's effectively a gun manufacturer's lobby while dropping most of the emphasis on responsibility, akin to auto makers forcing cars into the hands of untrained drivers (depending on where you live, it may already seem that way).

I am NOT parroting the talking point about "guns don't kill people, people in cars with guns do", I'm pointing out that the conversation has shifted unproductively from "rights and responsibilities" to "rights!" and too many people are just fine ignoring the responsibilities that accompany them. NO society will survive when everyone is ONLY out for themselves and has no obligation for stewardship of social order to their fellow citizens.]]> porruka Spork Central Thu, 02 May 2013 19:22:52 -0400 http://www.macedition.com/forums/read.php?4,20,42097#msg-42097 Re: Granberry's Parlor http://www.macedition.com/forums/read.php?4,20,42097#msg-42097
ddt]]> ddt Spork Central Thu, 02 May 2013 17:57:19 -0400 http://www.macedition.com/forums/read.php?4,20,42096#msg-42096 Re: Granberry's Parlor http://www.macedition.com/forums/read.php?4,20,42096#msg-42096 El Jeffe Spork Central Thu, 02 May 2013 17:56:44 -0400 http://www.macedition.com/forums/read.php?4,20,42095#msg-42095 Re: Granberry's Parlor http://www.macedition.com/forums/read.php?4,20,42095#msg-42095 johnny k Spork Central Thu, 02 May 2013 17:06:05 -0400